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Moderators: svgev, Maria Garcia Alvarez, Moderators
Help with province names
Help! Please forgive my ignorance, but I am rather new to the study of Spain. What is the difference between Asturian & Basque? Is not Austria in a Basque province? I do not want to offend anyone, but I am trying to locate info. about Bilbao and maybe the Cabezon Villas. Surnames Cabezon and Alonso. My grandfather was a barber by trade and lived in Calif. until 1960, when he died
Researching Mario Cabezon Alonso, possibly from Bilbao
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Bob
- Moderator
- Posts: 1774
- Joined: Mon Feb 24, 2003 3:54 am
- Location: Connecticut and Massachusetts
- asturias_and_me:
Hi Tom, and welcome to the forum.
Honest questions are never offensive: we all can learn from one another. Asturias is a principality (think of it as more or less the equivalent of an American state, although the analogy is quite inexact) on the north coast of Spain, just east of Galicia (which sits above Portugal, and west of Cantabria. The Basque region is further to the east, adjacent to France (in fact, it extends into France a bit). Asturias has a mild climate, and is green and beautiful, with steep and sometimes snow covered mountains separating it from the southern regions of Spain, and gorgeous beaches.
Asturias and Galicia each have their own language (asturianu and gallego), which are related to castellano (what most Americans think of as Spanish from Spain) but are distinctly different in terms of grammar and vocabulary. The ability of speakers of asturianu and castellano to understand each other has been estimated at about 80%, but based on asturianu texts I have shown to our Spanish Department faculty, most of whom are native speakers, the mutual intelligibility seems somewhat lower. Each has its own regional dialects. The modern asturianu codified by the Academy is based primarily on the central dialect.
Gallego leans more in the direction of Portuguese. It's all on a continuum, of course, and there is even an asturianu isolate in Miranda in northeastern Portugal. The former boundaries of asturianu speakers extended south into León.
The Basques speak an entirely separate and unrelated language, euskadi, which has contributed some words and sounds to the "Spanish" languages (such as izquierda = left). Some linguists think it is a linguistic isolate, unrelated to any other extant language. The Basques also represent a genetically distinct population from the rest of Spain, and have been in situ for a very long time. As a geneticist, I can confirm that the data that support this assertion are quite valid.
The name Alonso exists in Asturias, and is certainly not a Basque surname. Some of my own ancestors were Alonsos (from coastal central Asturias). Don't forget that our ancestors sometimes moved about a bit before eventually settling in the EEUU.
Have you checked the Ellis Island records for you grandfather or his parents? It's ofen a good starting point, and usually lists the ship, port from which it sailed, etc.
In any event, keep asking questions and posting any information you may have that can help others. You will find the people here friendly and helpful. Our members are about evenly divided between the US (EEUU) and Asturias, with a significant number from Peru, Argentina, Mexico, Cuba and other nations as well.
If there is a particular post that needs translating for you, just let us know and we will do our best.
Honest questions are never offensive: we all can learn from one another. Asturias is a principality (think of it as more or less the equivalent of an American state, although the analogy is quite inexact) on the north coast of Spain, just east of Galicia (which sits above Portugal, and west of Cantabria. The Basque region is further to the east, adjacent to France (in fact, it extends into France a bit). Asturias has a mild climate, and is green and beautiful, with steep and sometimes snow covered mountains separating it from the southern regions of Spain, and gorgeous beaches.
Asturias and Galicia each have their own language (asturianu and gallego), which are related to castellano (what most Americans think of as Spanish from Spain) but are distinctly different in terms of grammar and vocabulary. The ability of speakers of asturianu and castellano to understand each other has been estimated at about 80%, but based on asturianu texts I have shown to our Spanish Department faculty, most of whom are native speakers, the mutual intelligibility seems somewhat lower. Each has its own regional dialects. The modern asturianu codified by the Academy is based primarily on the central dialect.
Gallego leans more in the direction of Portuguese. It's all on a continuum, of course, and there is even an asturianu isolate in Miranda in northeastern Portugal. The former boundaries of asturianu speakers extended south into León.
The Basques speak an entirely separate and unrelated language, euskadi, which has contributed some words and sounds to the "Spanish" languages (such as izquierda = left). Some linguists think it is a linguistic isolate, unrelated to any other extant language. The Basques also represent a genetically distinct population from the rest of Spain, and have been in situ for a very long time. As a geneticist, I can confirm that the data that support this assertion are quite valid.
The name Alonso exists in Asturias, and is certainly not a Basque surname. Some of my own ancestors were Alonsos (from coastal central Asturias). Don't forget that our ancestors sometimes moved about a bit before eventually settling in the EEUU.
Have you checked the Ellis Island records for you grandfather or his parents? It's ofen a good starting point, and usually lists the ship, port from which it sailed, etc.
In any event, keep asking questions and posting any information you may have that can help others. You will find the people here friendly and helpful. Our members are about evenly divided between the US (EEUU) and Asturias, with a significant number from Peru, Argentina, Mexico, Cuba and other nations as well.
If there is a particular post that needs translating for you, just let us know and we will do our best.
Welcome, Tom!
What are the "Cabezón Villas" you mention? (By the way, I think "cabezón" means "big head".) There is a place called Cabezón de Sal in Cantábria.
Alonso is indeed a common name in Asturias. I have Alonso's in my family tree, too.
I may be wrong, but I recall someone saying that their family left for America from the port of Bilbao. It may be that your relatives left from that port, but came from elsewhere.
It would really help if you could add more specific information: names, parents, dates, places, work done in the US, etc.
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¡Bienvenida, Tom!
¿Qué es este "Cabezón Villas" que mencionas? (A propósito, pienso que el sentido de "cabezón" es "una cabeza grande".) Hay un lugar llamado Cabezón de la Sal en Cantábria.
Alonso es de verdad un nombre común en Asturias. Tengo Alonso en mi árbol genealógico, también.
Puedo equivocarme, pero recuerdo a alguien diciendo que su familia fue a América del puerto de Bilbao. Puede ser que sus parientes se marcharan de aquel puerto, pero vinieran de en otra parte.
Sería muy útil si pudieras añadir información más específica: nombres, padres, fechas, sitios, trabajo hecho en EU, etc.
What are the "Cabezón Villas" you mention? (By the way, I think "cabezón" means "big head".) There is a place called Cabezón de Sal in Cantábria.
Alonso is indeed a common name in Asturias. I have Alonso's in my family tree, too.
I may be wrong, but I recall someone saying that their family left for America from the port of Bilbao. It may be that your relatives left from that port, but came from elsewhere.
It would really help if you could add more specific information: names, parents, dates, places, work done in the US, etc.
---------------------
¡Bienvenida, Tom!
¿Qué es este "Cabezón Villas" que mencionas? (A propósito, pienso que el sentido de "cabezón" es "una cabeza grande".) Hay un lugar llamado Cabezón de la Sal en Cantábria.
Alonso es de verdad un nombre común en Asturias. Tengo Alonso en mi árbol genealógico, también.
Puedo equivocarme, pero recuerdo a alguien diciendo que su familia fue a América del puerto de Bilbao. Puede ser que sus parientes se marcharan de aquel puerto, pero vinieran de en otra parte.
Sería muy útil si pudieras añadir información más específica: nombres, padres, fechas, sitios, trabajo hecho en EU, etc.
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Terechu
- Moderator
- Posts: 1540
- Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2003 4:43 am
- Location: GIJON - ASTURIAS
- asturias_and_me:
Tom,
Even though Cabezón also means "big head", in this case it refers to a "head count", a tax census. This surname Cabezón comes from the Cantabrian town of "Cabezón de la Sal" - - literally meaning "salt tax census"
http://www.cabezondelasal.net/
The community (State) of Cantabria lies on the shores of the Bay of Biscay in northern Spain, between Asturias and the Basque Region and therefore the surname Cabezón is quite common in both these adjacent communities as well.
If you have no more detailed info, though, it will be difficult to get any further.
Even though Cabezón also means "big head", in this case it refers to a "head count", a tax census. This surname Cabezón comes from the Cantabrian town of "Cabezón de la Sal" - - literally meaning "salt tax census"
http://www.cabezondelasal.net/
The community (State) of Cantabria lies on the shores of the Bay of Biscay in northern Spain, between Asturias and the Basque Region and therefore the surname Cabezón is quite common in both these adjacent communities as well.
If you have no more detailed info, though, it will be difficult to get any further.
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Terechu
- Moderator
- Posts: 1540
- Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2003 4:43 am
- Location: GIJON - ASTURIAS
- asturias_and_me:
Art, "cabezón" is a head count for tax purposes, in other words a census. People had to pay taxes on all kinds of things, if they were fishermen, they had to pay taxes on the fish they caught, if they were cattle farmers, they had to pay cattle tax, if they produced salt, they paid salt taxes. While I don't know the history of Cabezón de la Sal, it is very likely that they had salines in that area (like Salinas in Asturias) and that they were their main livelihood and source of income.
That's interesting. Thanks, Terechu. I've always wondered what the heck "Cabezón de Sal" referred to. It's hard to imagine today (when we can easily buy a cheap little box of salt in the store) that people used to make a living exploiting salt deposits.
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Es interesante. Gracias, Terechu. Hace muchos años que estaba pensando a qué se refiere "Cabezón de Sal". Es difícil hoy en día imaginarme que había gente quienes se ganaron la vida por explotar depósitos de sal, ya que es facíl comprar baratísimo una cajita de sal en cualquiera tienda.
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Es interesante. Gracias, Terechu. Hace muchos años que estaba pensando a qué se refiere "Cabezón de Sal". Es difícil hoy en día imaginarme que había gente quienes se ganaron la vida por explotar depósitos de sal, ya que es facíl comprar baratísimo una cajita de sal en cualquiera tienda.
Alonso & Cabezon
First of all thank you for the information. How about Cabezon de Liebana, which I believe is also in Cantabria. My dictionary does not have the word "Liebana" so it would be a tax on what?
In terms of details I have very little. Mario Cabezon Alonso came to California in the 1900's, possibly around 1910. He married (I think) my grandmother Marie (May) Castell Gomez around 1911 in California. We cannot locate marriage records. My mother Marcella Henrietta Alonso was born 11 Oct 1912 in San Francisco, Calif. USA. Mario was employed as a barber and remained in San Francisco until circa 1919. His WW1 Draft registration shows him still in the city in Sept. 1918. Soon after I assume they divorced.
I then found him in San Ysidro, Calif. USA. He remarried a woman named Maura and continued as a barber. He died 2 Feb. 1960.
The only info. regarding his origin is my mother's notes which recorded his birthplace as Bilbao.
I am hoping that someone in the U.S. may recognize the man and we can help each other.
Thanks again
In terms of details I have very little. Mario Cabezon Alonso came to California in the 1900's, possibly around 1910. He married (I think) my grandmother Marie (May) Castell Gomez around 1911 in California. We cannot locate marriage records. My mother Marcella Henrietta Alonso was born 11 Oct 1912 in San Francisco, Calif. USA. Mario was employed as a barber and remained in San Francisco until circa 1919. His WW1 Draft registration shows him still in the city in Sept. 1918. Soon after I assume they divorced.
I then found him in San Ysidro, Calif. USA. He remarried a woman named Maura and continued as a barber. He died 2 Feb. 1960.
The only info. regarding his origin is my mother's notes which recorded his birthplace as Bilbao.
I am hoping that someone in the U.S. may recognize the man and we can help each other.
Thanks again
Researching Mario Cabezon Alonso, possibly from Bilbao
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Terechu
- Moderator
- Posts: 1540
- Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2003 4:43 am
- Location: GIJON - ASTURIAS
- asturias_and_me:
Tom, maybe this will be of interest. Just type the surname Cabezon in the box "primer apellido" or "segundo apellido" and select the province "Vizcaya" in the drop-down menu (Bilbao is the capital city of Vizcaya or Biscay) http://blancas.paginasamarillas.es/jsp/home.jsp
I found 10 persons by that surname in Vizcaya, some of them in Bilbao itself.
I forgot about Cabezón de Liébana, as it is very small, barely a village. "La Liébana" is a wonderful region in the mountains of Cantabria, bordering on Asturias and it was quite a significant enclave in the middle ages.
I found 10 persons by that surname in Vizcaya, some of them in Bilbao itself.
I forgot about Cabezón de Liébana, as it is very small, barely a village. "La Liébana" is a wonderful region in the mountains of Cantabria, bordering on Asturias and it was quite a significant enclave in the middle ages.
Hi: I am sorry, but I have been trying to locate a mailing address for the Registro Civil in Bilbao, but have had no luck. It is probably because my Spanish is so limited. I would be extremely grateful if someone in Spain could provide an address for me. I wish to send an inquiry regarding the birth of my grandfather.
I also need to know how I compensate the Civil Registro for their search efforts. May I sent a personal check from my bank in the U.S.? What would be the expected fee? Thank you very much for your help.
Tom Fox
I also need to know how I compensate the Civil Registro for their search efforts. May I sent a personal check from my bank in the U.S.? What would be the expected fee? Thank you very much for your help.
Tom Fox
Researching Mario Cabezon Alonso, possibly from Bilbao
-
Bob
- Moderator
- Posts: 1774
- Joined: Mon Feb 24, 2003 3:54 am
- Location: Connecticut and Massachusetts
- asturias_and_me:
Here's a link to a webform that can be used to ask for documents or information.
http://www.justizia.net/RegistroCivil/d ... &idioma=sp
I don't think there is any charge. When I wrote to other registros civiles for documents, no one ever asked for money. You don't need to enter a DNI number, and I would advise against sending your social security number over unsecure connections. Just explain that you don't have one because you are an American.
http://www.justizia.net/RegistroCivil/d ... &idioma=sp
I don't think there is any charge. When I wrote to other registros civiles for documents, no one ever asked for money. You don't need to enter a DNI number, and I would advise against sending your social security number over unsecure connections. Just explain that you don't have one because you are an American.
Registro Civil
Thank you very much for your help. I downloaded the form and also composed a letter requesting the birth certificate for my grandfather. I am sure the letter has many grammatical errors, but I hope I made myself understood. I put the papers in the mail this morning.
My only source for Bilbao as the birth place is what my deceased mother wrote in the family bible. I hope it is correct; if it is it will give me Mario's parents names, helping me to expand the search. Then of course, I will need to enroll in a Spanish course, as it has been too long since high school.
Take care
Tom Fox
My only source for Bilbao as the birth place is what my deceased mother wrote in the family bible. I hope it is correct; if it is it will give me Mario's parents names, helping me to expand the search. Then of course, I will need to enroll in a Spanish course, as it has been too long since high school.
Take care
Tom Fox
Researching Mario Cabezon Alonso, possibly from Bilbao