Franciso Ruiz de Valdes

[Lorene Valdez Salgardo]

Hello:
My sister and I recently had our Brother's DNA tested. We signed on to the New Mexico DNA Project. The Test results showed that his Haplogroup is I:Nordic. So now we know that the Paternal side of the Valdez is Haplogroup I and our Maternal side is Haplogroup B:Native American. Now, this leads me to the following: Our Family Tree shows that we are descendants of Jose (Luis) Ruiz de Valdes and Maria H. de Cabrera who came to New Mexico from New Spain in the 1600's. We know that Jose Ruiz came from Asturias, but we don't know if Francisco Ruiz de Valdes is his Father. Do you know of any Valdes, Valdez from Asturias who has had their DNA Tested? Also, from Jose Ruiz on down to my Father Benjamin, the Valdez name has been used. Would his Father had been Ruiz and his Mother de Valdes (z)?
If anyone has any answers please let me know.

[Eli]

Hi Lorene,

Although you are probably already familiar with most of this I’ll post it nonetheless. You’ll likely have better luck by working the other way around, instead of trying to find people with the same last name to match your Haplotype (not Haplogroup, in this case your haplogroup is “I” but there are millions of people within that Haplogroup, your Haplotype is at least 21 markers long preferably 43 or more the more markers you’ve tested the more unique the combination becomes. Haplogroups are identified by extremely unlikely mutations, something that shouldn’t have happened, Haplotypes are just the particular number of repetitions of some markers in the ‘junk’ DNA of Y and X) match your Haplotype to whomever is out there already. You most likely will find that within any given last name there will be several Haplogroups, this is because of adoptions, extramarital affairs, or failure to recognize a son, for instance if the father did not recognize his son for whatever reason, it was customary to give that child his maternal grandfather’s last name, in this case although he carries his father’s Haplotgroup he would carry his maternal grandfather’s last name.

Anyways, to find matches for your Haplotype you could use some of these databases

http://www.ybase.org/
on this one Valdez returns no matches
http://www.ysearch.org/
on this one Valdez returns six matches at
http://www.ysearch.org/lastname_lastname.asp?
uid=&lastname=Valdez&searchtype=exact&region=&excludeuid=
http://www.smgf.org/pages/ydatabase.jspx
the tools here are very interesting and helpful, no contact info provided

You’ll also find Valdez on these projects
http://www.ftdna.com/surname_join.asp?c ... ecial=true
http://www.ftdna.com/surname_join.asp?c ... ecial=true
http://www.ftdna.com/surname_join.asp?c ... ecial=true
http://www.ftdna.com/surname_join.asp?c ... ecial=true
(That last one is a Mexican surname group so it is likely you the one listed there)
http://www.ftdna.com/surname_join.asp?c ... ecial=true
http://www.ftdna.com/(w0aiqhzbotzigj55k ... _de_Espana
http://www.ftdna.com/surname_join.asp?c ... ecial=true


Also you may want to subscribe to e-mail lists that discuss Y-DNA you can find the archives for one of the better ones at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/index/GENEALOGY-DNA this one can get a little too technical for most folks but it’s pretty good.

A group you probably should join
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DNA-NEWBIE/messages

A group you may find interesting
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DNA-ANTHR ... Y/messages

a pretty good and basic explanation of DNA http://blairgenealogy.com/dna/dna101.html
a more technical explanation of Haplogroups http://www.worldfamilies.net/y-haplogroups.htm

Hope that helps,

Elí

ps. I'm no expert but if you have any questions I'll try to answer them, if I can't I'm sure to provide you with contact info on somebody that can. Btw what laboratory did you use for the test?

[Lorene Valdez Salgardo]

Eli:
Thanks for the information. We were notified that we had one close match. It was 24/25 markers. This person doesn't answer my e-mail request to share genealogy information. But, he does state that his last name is his adopted name. The New Mexico DNA Project has four Valdez Project members but none match our Haplotype. Our kit was requested through Family Tree DNA.com. I also have done a "Y" search at www.ysearch.org.

[Eli]

Looks like you've covered the basics, searching through geographical databases is your only option for now. Short of convincing folks with the Valdez name that you suspect might be related to you in Spain to take the test themselves.

You may find searching/comparing the info on this databse interesting, although it will prove useless for genealogy purposes.
http://www.yhrd.org/index.html

[Lorene Valdez Salgardo]

Eli:

It's been an interesting journey. My sister did the majority of the research on the Family Tree and I thought it was complete and then I read about DNA testing. Now we're hooked!

[Carlos]

Lorene, en el año 1600 no existía el mismo sistema de apellidos que ahora se usa en el Estado Español. En la actualidad se emplea un sistema vigente desde que se proclamó la llamada "Ley del Registro Civil", promulgada en el año 1871.

Esta ley obligaba a que los ayuntamientos hicieran constar los nacimientos, bodas y defunciones de todas las personas en un libro oficial, siendo el encargado de llevar ese libro un juez, él solo o con la ayuda de otros funcionarios. La dicha ley obligaba a inscribir a los recién nacidos con las siguientes condiciones:

-nombre de pila impuesto en el bautismo por el cura (nombre simple o compuesto)
-primer apellido, tomado del de su padre (del primero si acaso éste ya tenía dos)
-segundo apellido, tomado del de su madre (idem)
-lugar de nacimiento (población, ayuntamiento y provincia)
-fecha (día, mes y año)
-nombre de pila y dos apellidos de su padre
-nombre de pila y dos apellidos de su madre

Así queda incrito el bebé con un nombre y dos apellidos. Cuando esta persona crece, se casa y tiene hijos, éstos heredan de nuevo el primer apellido de su padre y el primer apellido de su madre. Las mujeres nunca pierden sus apellidos por el hecho de casarse, pero de los dos, sus hijos sólo heredan el primero.

En el año 1600 la situación era mucho más anárquica, pero en general la gente tenía un nombre (o varios) y un único apellido. Otros componentes del nombre podían referirse a la tierra de origen o a un linaje noble. Ése es el caso de Valdés, que debe escribirse con S. La escritura con Z es un error frecuente entre latinoamericanos, dada la pronunciación igual, al asimilar la terminación -ÉS con la típica de los apellidos en -EZ (como Fernández o Rodríguez). Sin embargo, repara en que en éstos la terminación -EZ es átona, mientrás que en Valdés, -ÉS/-ÉZ lleva acento, luego no estamos ante el mismo caso.

El apellido Valdés deriva del concejo (municipio) asturiano del mismo nombre, cuya capital es Luarca. La etimología de este municipio es la siguiente:

VALLE + DE + ES, apocopado en VAL + D'ES.

Este "ES" es el nombre apocopado de un río, el ESVA, también llamado CANEIRU. El nombre más antiguo del río es precisamente ESVA, de origen prerromano, también llamado ÉSEVA. La partícula "VA" es una antigua palabra indoeuropea con significado de 'agua, corriente de agua, río'. Hay muchos otros ríos en Europa con esa misma terminación, por ejemplo, el Móscova, que dio su nombre a Moscú. Cuando los astures pasaron a utilizar el latín resultó tautológico decir 'RIVUM ÉSEVA', que podríamos traducir como 'el río del río ESE', lo que explica la desaparición del -VA final.

En definitiva, que tu primer antepasado se apellidaba en realidad RUIZ, indicando el 'DE VALDÉS' únicamente de dónde era originario.

Este apellido se extendió después por muchos lugares de América Latina, pero tienes que tener en cuenta que los esclavos negros de las plantaciones de lo que hoy son los USA tomaban el apellido del dueño de su plantación, motivo por el que hoy puedes ver a un afroamericano apellidado MacAllister sin que tenga ninguna relación con Escocia. Lo mismo sucedió en las haciendas de los terratenientes españoles, si el propietario se llamaba Valdés, todos los indios, negros o mestizos que allí trabajaban, fueran libres o esclavos, se apellidaban igual. Por eso sería ilusorio pensar que todos y cada uno de los actuales Valdés de América Latina son de origen asturiano, puede que sí, o puede que no, según el caso.

En todo caso, y ya que tienes hecho tu estudio de DNA, quizás te interese esta información:

Marcadores genéticos de los asturianos.

Un estudio realizado sobre polimorfismos de HLA y ADN en una muestra de 117 asturianos no da diferencias significadas a nivel alélico con poblaciones peninsulares ni tampoco europeas, aún cuando se encontraron ciertas divergencias para el alelo HUMTHO1, entre asturianos y otras poblaciones peninsulares (Marco y col. 1992)

Más valor significativo tienen los estudios de marcadores genéticos estudiados del HLA a nivel de haplotipos. Entre los haplotipos presentes en la población asturiana, el dominante es el AH7.1(HLA-A3/B7/DR15) que es muy frecuente asimismo en Galicia, en el sur de Gran Bretaña y en Irlanda; el AH44.2, propio de las regiones atlánticas; el AH18.1 habitual en el Mediterráneo y el AH8.1, frecuente en regiones centroeuropeas y Escandinavia. Otros haplotipos, como el formado por HLA-A11/B27/DR1, típico de población vasca, es asimismo relativamente frecuente en Asturias. Otros marcadores del ADN no tan polimórficos como el anterior indican una distribución similar, aun cuando no tan marcada como en el caso del HLA. Un estudio realizado con 5 STR muestra una distribución en Asturias similar a la publicada por Carracedo y cols. en población gallega (A. López, 2004).

La coincidencia del haplotipo dominante AH7.1(HLA-A3/B7/DR15) en Asturias y sus altas frecuencias, asimismo, en Galicia, Irlanda y sur de Gran Bretaña, parece indicar un grado de comunicación e intercambio genético en dicha área coincidente con un soporte cultural celta, aún cuando esta unidad cultural no necesariamente comporta una unidad racial y sería preciso indagar antes lo que ocurre con muchos otros marcadores (...)

Autor: Pedro Gómez Gómez, en 'Los Asturianos', obra colectiva editada por el diario La Nueva España.

A mí personalmente todo esto me suena a chino, pero puedes consultar con Bob Martínez, que es genetista y te lo podrá explicar.

Saludos.

[Lorene Valdez Salgardo]

Carlos:
Muchas gracias por la informacion. Si, en 1038 Valdes era una region. El origen del nombre Valdes viene de esa region. La Familia de Rodrigo Melendez de Valdes fueron las primeras persones que usaron el apellido en los anos de 1100.
Un amigo miyo que estudia genealogia dice que Francisco Ruiz de Valdes nacio 17 de April en 1634 in Valladolid, Valladolid, Espana.
Bernabe Ruiz de Cotronal era su padre y Maria de Valdes era su madre. Por sus estudios de genealogia, mi amigo dice que Valdes is el apellido de su madre.

Todavia estoy estudiano "Marcadores Geneticos de los Asturianos". No puedo leer or escribir en Espanol muy bueno. Mi herman trata de traducir mis palabras.

[Art]

[Art: I've translated the text Carlos' included in his message above.]

Asturian Genetic Markers.

A study made on polymorphisms of HLA and DNA in a sample of 117 Asturians does not show significant differences at the allelic level with peninsular or European populations, even though there were certain divergences for the allele HUMTHO1 between Asturian and other peninsular populations (Marco et al., 1992).

The studies of genetic markers of the HLA at level of haplotypes have been more significant. Among the haplotypes present in the Asturian population, the dominant one is AH7.1 (HLA-A3/B7/DR15), which is very frequent also in Galicia, the south of Great Britain, and Ireland; the AH44.2, which is typical of the Atlantic regions; AH18.1, which is common in the Mediterranean; and the AH8.1, which is frequently found in Central European regions and Scandinavia. Other haplotypes, like the one formed by HLA-A11/B27/DR1, which is typical of Basque population, are also relatively common in Asturias. Other DNA markers that are not as polymorphic [Art: ¿having various forms or styles?] as the previous ones show a similar distribution, even though not so marked as in the case of the HLA. A study made with 5 STR shows a distribution in Asturias similar to that published by Carracedo et al. in the Galician population (A. Lopez, 2004).

The matching of the dominant haplotype AH7.1 (HLA-A3/B7/DR15) in Asturias and its high frequencies, also, in Galicia, Ireland and the south of Great Britain, seems to indicate a degree of communication and genetic interchange in this area, which corresponds to a Celtic cultural matrix/structure, even though this cultural entity/identity may not necessarily entail a racial entity/identity, and it would be necessary to investigate what is going on with many other markers (...)

Author: Pedro Gómez Gómez, in "The Asturians," a collective work published by the newspaper, La Nueva España.

[Lorene Valdez Salgardo]

Art:

Thanks for the translation. That was a tuffy!

On the New Mexico DNA Project website it states that Haplotype I is consistent with 13% of the population of Spain today. In 409, the Suebi (Baltic People), then the Vandals (Eastern Germanic People) and then the Visigoths (Homeland Sweden) populated the Iberian Peninsula which is consistent with Haplotype I.

Both parents were born in New Mexico so joining the New Mexico DNA Project seemed like a good fit.

The following was taken from Herencia, Volume 14, Issue 4 July 2006 "The results of the New Mexico DNA Project vividly show the diverse genetic origins of individuals who are descendants of the families that settled New Mexico during the era of the Spanish Empire (1598-1821)".

[Bob]

Yes, Art, polymorphic is right. it simply refers to a situation in which there are multiple forms of something.

[Lorene Valdez Salgardo]

Bob,

Art's "Polymorphic", Having various form or styles or your Situation in which there are multiple forms of something is like Carlos' reply:
"todo esto me suena a chino". I hope that it means it's all chinese to me!

So far I've had a reply from Eli, Carlos, Art and now you. I feel very privileged.

[Art]

Bob, what is that sentence saying in plain English/

Other DNA markers that are not as polymorphic as the previous ones show a similar distribution, even though not so marked as in the case of the HLA.

-------------

Bob, ¿Qué significa esa frase in inglés sencillo?

Otros marcadores del ADN no tan polimórficos como el anterior indican una distribución similar, aun cuando no tan marcada como en el caso del HLA.

[Lorene Valdez Salgardo]

Bob and Art:

I'm Polymorphic out!!!! Thanks for trying. My unomorphic can only take so much information.

[Lorene Valdez Salgardo]

Art & Bob
I just received an e-mail from a genetic cousin. This cousin is related to me from my Mother's side of the DNA tracks. My Father's ancestors were from Asturias but we found that my Mother's was Haplotype B: Pueblo Indian. I know I'm repeating myself but I just had to say it. She is from New Mexico and we have very little to go by as far as Surnames. This cousin is a big help. Her Brother's Mitochondrial DNA (mtDNA) matched my Brothers. In other words we have someone who has exactly the same changes within their sequence as my brother. When they tested the HVR-1 (HyperVariable Region 1) and the HVR2 region which helps to pick out the individuals with whom we most likely share a common ancestor in a genealogical time frame we have a match.

We know that the results of the DNA testings the sequences were different from the Cambridge Reference Sequence (CRS). These mutations were what made us similar. Now that brings me to your explanation of Mutation vs. Polymorphism. So I went on the internet to see if I could find another explanation and the following is what I found:

A Mutation: Is induced from outside the cell: by an exogenous factor, is inheritable and will not necessarily be harmful to the host.
A Polymorphism: Is induced from within the cell.
A Polymorphism when studied are useful for: forensic anaysis (DNA profiling), mapping disease genes and testing for genetic disease. (From Protocol online and Polymorphism and genetic Testing)

Our mtDNA results gives us mutations which were passed down to the children and through time using proper documentation and historical data these mutations can be associated with geographic areas and populations. (from Family Tree DNA)

Our test was not for genetic disease. We were given results of mutations that led us to Native American and the Southwest as part of our heritage.

[Art]

Thanks, Lorene. That explanation of polymorphism is interesting.

Did your cousin contact you through the testing company?

--------------

Gracias, Lorene. Esa explicación de polimorfismo es interesante.

¿Cómo es que tu primo se pudo en contacto con tigo, por el negocio de pruebas?