Asturian-American Migration Forum

It all boils down to a fabada... In our case it all boils down to the sofitu (support) that we can get from Asturies. I'll try to briefly describe the situation regarding the different Immigrations Agencies in Asturies and then we can all together plan a strategy.

There are two official entities (agencies or offices) that deal with immigration in Asturies: (interestingly enough they are kind of independent of each other)

1) Consejo de Comunidades Asturianas, directed by Manolo Fdez. de la cera. This office reports directly to the President of Asturias, Tini Areces (PSOE) and it is the one in charge of organizing the numerous Centros Asturianos around the world. Dela Cera participated in our Symposium last year; he is a very nice man, an old time politician (he was Conseyeru d'educación for nearly 15 years) but he represents the old guard; that is, he sees the Asturian immigration as only represented by Centros Asturianos. Everything and everybody who is not within a traditional Centro Asturiano loses punch with him. (I repeat, that's my impression)

2) Axencia asturiana d'emigracion: directed by Luis Miguel Fdez. Romero (Luismi). This office reports to the Conseyería de Xusticia, segurida y relaciones esteriores del Principau. This is the only Conseyeria not controlled by PSOE, but by IU (Izquierda unida) and the conseyero's name is Valledor. Chema Vega also works here and reports to the tandem Luismi/Valledor. This office seems to be much more progressive and conscious about the current "non traditional" immigrant situation and they appear to be specially sensitive to issues such as mocedá (youth), llingua asturiana and representing the essence of asturian folk traditions (music, dance...)


These are the people that can give us the support. Now, elections May 27 can change things a bit, although I don't anticipate any change at all. (in any case, there is nothing we can do about that) PSOE will continue to seek control of the Asturian Parliament by joining forces with IU against PP. I can't see any other alternative to that.

Chema Vega wrote me a couple of extra effusive messages after the Xornaes and he loved the idea of the Band of Gaites USA. He said he'd do everything possible to help us. Bras also told me that he had dinner with Luismi after NY and he also told him about us in very positive terms. I am going to write an official grant proposal to the Axencia asturiana d'emigracion. I have already sent a e-mail to Luismi giving him a preview of our plan and what we need: 30 gaites, traxes, percusion and some help with the learning process.
I have done nothing with Consejo de Comunidades Asturianas. I know dela Cera, and precisely because of that, I fear that he might feel offended if I ask him for support now after not inviting him to the Xornaes. In fact, there was no reason why he wasn't invited; everything was so fast that there was no time to think about possible implications if somebody comes or doesn't come . Maybe Paul can use his charms to talk him into the idea. I think you should talk to him when you go to Asturies, Paul. I might talk to him too once I am there, and maybe Andres can try it too.

This is pretty much the situation now. We are in a very good position regarding the Axencia, but not with el Consejo. I am not sure if we should try both or just wait to see if Axencia moves ahead and if not, knock at the Consejo's door.

I guess we should also be prepared and come up with a plan in case we don't get anything.

I am looking forward for your input here.

Most of Alberto's plan makes good sense to me politically.

In particular, I support Alberto's idea of including Manuel de la Cera in our conversations and asking for his support, even if it's just to keep him in the loop just so he felt excluded. (Of course, he could try to prevent our getting support no matter what we do.)

My question is about the size of our request, so I'd like to think about the thirty gaitas aspect a bit.

Is the Principality's support going to a once only thing or ongoing?

I ask that because my count shows that we have at best nine gaiteros at the moment.

[Here's my count of potential gaiteros: Paul, Natalia, Bob, Evelyn, Alberto, Tony, Art, JoAnne, and possibly Andres -- for a total of 9. Bob's kids could possibly add another one or two. (JoAnne, my wife, surprised me when she told me today that she was considering playing with us. She's played other wind instruments, so she might pick it up quickly.)]

When I worked for the federal government I learned that if I needed to order a fairly large amount of supplies I had to inflate it a little, by half again or double. Then the boss would cut my order in half and I'd get exactly the amount I really needed. It was a silly game, but it worked.

If I were an administrator, I'd want to know specifics:

• who is leading the group
• what organizations are supporting us
• how many participants do we have
• do we have practice spaces and teachers lined up
• and so forth.

I'd look at a proposal to see if it had careful estimates and reasonable expectations. We have a number of members who are fairly well known in Asturias, so that's good.

But thirty gaitas would strike me as unreasonable given our numbers. I'd have a hard time justifying it. I'd feel comfortable asking for 10 or 12 gaitas, 3 or so tambores, and 15 or so trajes.

Could Natalia give us some insight into how much we really need to plan ahead in purchasing this equipment?

Then again, maybe thirty gaitas etal isn't much given the scale they're dealing with. And maybe they'd rather approve that rather than have us come back to them several times in the future.

Or maybe I'm just too modest in my thinking.

What do you all think about this concern?

Saludos a todos.

A ver, unas cosinas.

Las elecciones municipales y autonómicas son dentro de dos meses, enseguida empezará la campaña. Si esto fuera un país "normal", eso no significaría nada. Pero Asturies es cualquier cosa menos normal. Izquierda Unida está enzarzada ahora mismo en una terrible guerra interna. IU no es en realidad un partido, sino una coalición electoral formada por varios partidos, corrientes y personas independientes, o al menos así era cuando empezó. El principal de esos partidos es el Partido Comunista de Asturias (PCA). Éstos a su vez pertenecen al Partido Comunista de España (PCE).

El caso es que el PCA es la parte más verdaderamente de izquierdas, la que no se vende tan fácilmente por los puestos oficiales, etc. Son digamos que la gente que más estrechamente vigila al PSOE. A nivel de todo el Estado, el PC tiene esta postura mayoritariamente, pero en Asturies son minoría.

La mayoría del PCA es bastante moderada y son los que llevan a la práctica el apoyo al PSOE. De palabra son más abiertos, menos sectarios, no piensan en la URSS, etc. Pero esto son las declaraciones, porque la práctica diaria los convierte en rehenes del PSOE. No hacen una verdadera oposición, o mejor dicho, es una oposición únicamente verbal, pero luego nada de nada, hacen un seguidismo total del PSOE.

El sábado pasado hubo simultáneamente dos congresos, el del PCA y el de IU, donde unos se descalifican a otros y toman medidas de represalia mutuas. ¡Y todo esto a 2 meses de las elecciones!

Esto está dando una imagen pública penosa, y no cabe duda de que va a tener un coste electoral. Si esto fuera poco, hay mucha gente que previamente estaba muy descontenta con IU, por esa incoherencia demostrada durante 4 años con el PSOE asturiano. Podría citar muchos casos en que IU, como parte del gobierno asturiano, vota, consiente o tolera determinadas decisiones, y luego ¡salen a la calle a manifestarse contra el propio gobierno del que forman parte! De ahí que esa especie de esquizofrenia de IU mucha gente no la vea seria y el descontento con ellos.

En definitiva, que no se sabe que va a pasar con el señor Valledor y los cargos políticos que él designa directamente (Romero y Vega).

Por otro lado hace ya algunos meses salió a la palestra en la prensa el tema de que se iba a modificar la llamada "Ley de Asturianía", de modo que tuvieran cabida en esas relaciones institucionales otras asociaciones diferentes del típico "Centro Asturiano de..."

En realidad, la argumentación para no incluir a, por ejemplo, ASMA (mi hijastro pertenece a ella), es que debe procurarse que no haya más que una sola asociación (Centro) en la misma ciudad, de ahí la postura beligerante del de Madrid con ASMA. Pero eso no se mantiene en pie, porque en Buenos Aires hay nada menos que 4 centros asturianos, el que se llama oficialmente así, y otros más como la Casa de Siero-Noreña. El único argumento es que esos son centros históricos que ya existían décadas antes de 1977 en que tenemos Autonomía, Consejo de Comunidades, Ley de Asturianía, etc.

Por otro lado, en realidad no está nada claro el papel que tiene que jugar en este caso el señor Valledor. Su consejería es la Justicia y Relaciones Exteriores, que en teoría no tendría que ocuparse de centros asturianos, emigrantes ni nada parecido. Pero digamos que IU de alguna manera encontró un "furacu" que no tenía ocupado el PSOE, y pensó que por ahí se podía intentar captar votos. Lo de Relaciones Exteriores se supone que tiene que ver más bien con cooperación, relaciones institucionales del gobierno asturiano con otras autonomías, propiciar negocios, y cosas así no demasiado especificadas. Por supuesto, cuando los socialistas se dieron cuenta de que les estaban "suplantando", procuraron "puentear" a Valledor todo lo que pudieron, por ejemplo con viajes del señor Areces sin el conocimiento de Valledor.

Todo esto es para que os situeis mejor en quién es quién en todo este asunto y de qué va el juego.

Si esta consejería no la ocupara IU, no solo no habría ningún problema, sino que probablemente habría toda la cooperación del mundo entre Exteriores y Cultura. No es que ahora no la haya, pero no siempre todo va sobre ruedas, por esa competencia entre las dos fuerzas.

En resumen, nada impide dirigirse a ambos a la vez, pero sabiendo de qué va la cosa.

Mientras se cambia o no se cambia esa Ley de Asturianía, de momento son los centros asturianos los que sirven de intermediación entre el gobierno asturiano y los emigrantes. Esperemos que finalmente se abran canales a la participación de otra gente.

En todo caso, insisto en que es Cultura quien sufraga los gastos de trajes o instrumentos. Valledor puede hacer de intermediario, pero su presupuesto es mucho más limitado, y no olvidemos que depende del reparto de partidas que previamente se hace cuando se elaboran los presupuestos generales del gobierno, en cuyo seno se decide cuánto dinero va para cada consejería y en concepto de qué.

Con respecto a Corvera y sus gaitas en Si bemol. Bueno, pero es que nadie dice que no podais tocar con gaitas en Si bemol. Lo que ocurre es que no necesariamente tienen por qué ser de ese mismo modelo de gaita en Si bemol. Por ejemplo, existe la banda de gaitas de Jorge Areces, en Mieres, con instrumentos en Si bemol pero de un solo roncón, que responde más a las gaitas tradicionales.

En cuestiones técnicas, existen clarinetes en Do y en Si bemol, y también en este caso los segundos son de mayor longitud que los primeros, como con los saxos. Art, tú que tocas la guitarra, sabrás de sobra que una cuerda no da la misma nota según pongas los dedos en un traste o en otro. Es decir, más centímetros de cuerda vibrando producen una nota grave, menos centímetros una nota más aguda.

A un punteru más largo le corresponde un roncón también más largo. Cuando tenemos un punteru y un roncón más cortos, es posible quitar el punteru y poner otro más largo, y hacer que el roncón suene más grave con un pequeño truco, que es poner otro payón más grave y/o estirar más las piezas del roncón.

Por lo tanto, una gaita en Do es susceptible de utilizar un punteru en Si bemol.

Pero lo que no resulta tan fácil es hacer lo contrario, tener una gaita en Si bemol y ponerle un punteru en Do, porque llega un punto en el que nos sobran cm de largo en el roncón, y por más que queramos encogerlo llega un momento en que las piezas hacen tope.

Yo no me niego a utilizar gaitas en Si bemol, de hecho Felpeyu toca con una gaita en esa tonalidad construida por mí, pero eso sí, buscando la sonoridad típica de la gaita asturiana, no otras cosas. Además, NUNCA una gaita asturiana va a sonar como una escocesa, por cuestiones de medidas internas que determinan fenómenos acústicos como el timbre y el volumen.

Respecto a métodos, posiblemente el mejor es el de la Consejería de hace años, como ya mencionó alguien. Éste consistía en un libro y 4 cassettes. Las melodías contenidas en esos cassettes las tengo pasadas a CD, de modo que os las puedo copiar sin problema, de tal manera que las podais escuchar en cualquier reproductor o en el PC.

Están pensadas para que cualquiera pueda aprender un mínimo de melodías sin saber leer solfeo. Comienzan con un tempo más lento de lo normal para que quien aprende se pueda fijar bien en cada una de las notas, y luego son tocadas a la velocidad que corresponde en cada caso.

Bueno, seguiremos en contacto.

Saludos.

Very interesting points. I think we are in the right direction here. First I'd like to thank Carlos for his extremely valuable insights. He offers a current local asturian perspective that none of us can have. According to what he says, it's pretty clear that we should inlcude Manolo de la Cera (Consejo) in the proposal and make the request to him too. Andres: mark your calendar for your Asturies visit next week; you need to talk to Dela Cera. I'll give you his phone and address later


I see Art's point trying to think as an administrator. Quite frankly, I don;t beleive that administrators in Asturies (and specifically in el Consejo y la Axencia) think like any of us. I have the sense that they do things more the "good old boy's" way. Of course we have to have a proposal specifing the things that Art points out, but the decision will be mainly based on other aspects (if they like us, if we are politically interesting to them, and so on)

Regarding the number of potential gaiteros (requests). We have to add ASUSA's to Art's numbers. When I sent the message explaining the idea to ASUSA's maillist I got 6 responses from people interested: Santiago Garcia Castañón (Georgia), Marisol Fernandez (not sure where she is at), Fatima Serra (New England), Pablo Toral (Wisconsin-Chicago), Paz Tarrio (NJ), Reyes Fidalgo (California Fullerton). I am sure we could get more people on board within ASUSA and also Centro Ast. de Tampa

That's 15 of us right now.

The rationale behind the number 30 was, as Art indicated ask for more to get half of what you ask for. If we ask for 30, we might get 15. If we ask for 15 we might get 7. But I understand Art's concerns here and I guess this is something we could discuss. Maybe we could say 20; that sounds more reasonable. I don't know. Whatever the number, I would propose a whole package including traxes, percussion and some type of help with the learning process.

Regarding the "Si bemoles". If playing in St. Pat's is our main motivator here, we don't have much choice but to get "Si's". There were other bands playing in NY with Corvera (Banda de Gaites de Xixon and banda de Gozón) and they all play si's. To the best of my knowledge the three roncones are only added for the parade to help increase the volume. By the way, Xixon had two roncones not three, so this has to be something that they do on this special ocassions to boost their sound. I am attaching a photo here: Corvera is on the right, Xixon on the left.

In any case, I do not want to diverge from our main topic in this thread which is to try to find a good strategy to get support. Again, I think we are in the right track here.





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Again: I don't want to divert from the support strategy conversation; but if you look carefully at the picture, at the far left there is a chubby guy playing a gaita blanca with only one roncon. maybe Carlos can tells us more about it. In any case this proves that it can be done, we don't need the three roncones by any means and a regular one roncon Bi gaita would do it.

Remember that the website already has at least an indirect connection with Manolo de la Cera, who I met at the Rollins conference and who is indeed a very nice person, through our co-moderator Terechu (Teresa Rondo). She is a Gijonesa and her husband Ivan is a former student of de la Cera. Whether the connection is good or not, we would have to ask her.

What about inviting de la Cera to the May screening of Luis Argeo's documentary in West Virginia (in May) and using that as a starting point for our proposal to him?

Personally, I was a little disappointed that de la Cera wasn't at the Pace event because I enjoyed talking ith him at Rollins and would have like to see him again, but I understand the rushed circumstances.

As far as the flautas go (as opposed to the gaites y traxes) it may be good to purchase more than we think we need so that we have an immediate supply on hand for anyone who wishes to join us later. A two or three week delay in ordering extras from Asturias may dampen enthusiasm. I would be williing to contribute toward a fund for this.

I'm curious. In the photo of the two bandas marching side by side, one wears the big ala of the montera picona on the left and one on the right. Why?

En el mensaje anterior mencionaba una banda de gaitas en Si bemol con un solo roncón, pero aquí podeis ver otra de las mismas características mucho más conocida, la Banda de Gaitas Ciudad de Oviedo. Como podeis observar en la foto, sólo poseen un roncón, no dos ni tres:



Precisamente la imagen se corresponde con una actuación en USA.

Aquí podeis descargar un archivo Zip del himno de Asturias tocada por esta banda, donde se puede escuchar perfectamente la tonalidad de Si bemol:

http://www.geocities.com/ciudaddeoviedo ... _himno.zip

Además, pensad en otra cuestión básica para principiantes. Una gaita cuesta cierto trabajo de ser tocada, porque consume aire. ¿Alguien se paró a pensar que por cuatro furacos escapa el doble de aire que por dos?

Bueno, seguro que me queda algo en el tintero, pero en otro momento seguimos.

Saludos

Thanks for the photo and the information, Carlos. How does the sound compare (outdoors) to that of gaites with two or three roncones?

And I just have to ask, "Country Bear Jamboree?" Where was the photo taken?

Bob

Carlos's photo looks very familiar. In fact, this place is 20 min. away from my home. It is Disney's Magic Kingdom (Frontierland to be exact). That explains the Bears Jamboree. I have to say I always liked the banda d'gaites de Oviedo traxes and their blue decorated gaites. Any comments regarding the support strategy?

I too like the traxes. Maybe we should consider them for our group?

I've opened a line of dialogue with Quinnipiac's adminstration that may (repeat - may) lead to the possibility of some funding. Our president, John Lahey, has been in the past grand master of the St. Patrick's Day parade in New York, and is VERY into Celtic culture in general. My gambit may or may not pay off. Thenj again, he is a bit of a grandiose megalomaniac. I will, of course keep everyone posted, but I don't want to ask for money until I'm sure we can deliver something.

Abrazos,

Bob

On strategy:
Yes, I think we're probably ready in terms of strategy. Alberto (Tranbanco), you've done some good work, and you're probably right about the good-old-boys decision-making process.

Now we should circulate what you've written to see if we need to fine-tune it.

On gaitas:
I also think you're right, Alberto that we don't need three roncones. We'll be struggling as it is with the air requirements of one.

Plus, having a single roncón would make us notably different from the Scottish. That'd be good because people would be more likely to ask, "Hey, that bagpipe looks different. Where are you from?"

(I'm pretty sure extra roncones can be added later, if we decide we need them because it's mostly a matter of tying new asientos/stocks into the fuelle/bag, and sliding new roncones into the asientos. But the fuelle and vestido/covering might have to be changed, too.)

¿Carlos: Una gaita en ambos Do /Si bemol?
I wonder if Carlos could make us a Do / Si bemol gaita, in other words, one that would be easy to switch keys? I've seen it done successfully with a C/D gaita gallega. It had two punteros and a little ring that opened or closed a hole in the roncón so it would play in D or C. It was a beautiful instrument.

Bob: I think your idea about inviting Dela Cera to Luis Argeo's presentation of his documentary in WV is a great one. Do you have more details about dates and so on?

Luis has reported that his documenytary has been selected for the Documenta Madrid, and that the festival will run from May 4th to May 13th

www.documentamadrid.com

As ar as the screening in the EEUU goes, Luis has written that "the West Virginia Labor History Association will show the film during its Film Night in Charleston (WV), next May the 12th . I do not remember the hour, but I think it will be at 7 pm.
AsturianUS will share the screen with another documentary film, The Battle of Local 5668, by Shawn Bennett."

Whether de la Cera is invited to see the film in Madrid, in West Virginia or both, the important thing - in my opinion - is that we invited him. That's all the information I have. We should write to Luis and ask him directly.

I just wrote to Luis Argeo asking for details on the days and times of his film's screening in Madrid and West Virginia. I'll post the information as soon as I get an answer.

I just found a very prompt reply from Luís Argeo in my mailbox.

What he knows at this point is that his documentary film will be shown in Charleston (WV) during the West Virginia Labor History Association Film Night in May, the 12th, at 7 pm. at The Historic La Belle Theater (311 D Street, South Charleston, WV). He suggests that we call 304 744 9711 to ask for more information.

As far as the Madrid Film Festival, he has possible showing dates of May (4-13th), but does not yet know the exact schedule for showing his film. He thinks they will run it twice.

The question remains, who is the best person to invite whom (de la Cera, CHema Vega and others) to what?

Un abrazu pa toos y toes,

Bob