Asturian-American Migration Forum

This is infuriating. How embarrassing that Gijon (and Asturies) is finally represented in the top league after 10+ years, and this is how the fans act on the first game back. Disgusting.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/s ... index.html

Yeah, that's pretty disgusting. Unfortunately, I think the Sporting fans are mimicking behavior they've seen among Real Madrid fans. They probably think it's do-able if the people in Madrid do it. It's sad, but that's the way things go in contemporary Asturias.

Incidentally, I was in Peru a long time ago and war broke out on the border with Ecuador. In Peru, the slur against people from Ecuador in the north is 'monos'. I don't know if the word/expression is being transferred into mainstream Madrid-Spanish by way of Peruvian immigrants settled in Spain. Maybe someone else can clue us in?

Very disgusting to me

It is obvious there're idiots all around the world. No comment.

You're right Is. Some years ago, I don't exactly remember what soccer match it was, but I guess it was Madrid vs. Barcelona, some Madrid fans did it to Eto'o.

I don't think the pejorative use of "mono" has been adopted from Peruvians. Sad but true it's the word some airheads use to refer to black people.

Tampoco hay que sacar las cosas de quicio.

En España, entre la gente, todavía no caló esa enorme hipocresía que es lo "políticamente correcto", y a un negro, se le llama negro (y a un gallego, gallego).

Y en un ambiente festivo, pues puede ocurrir que la gente se meta con determinados jugadores, por su físico o su raza. Y basta para que desde otros ámbitos hablen de ello, para que se repita más.

No quiere decir esto que en España no exista racismo, pero desde luego, no al nivel, creo, de los países anglosajones.

Una cosa es el lenguaje, y otra los hechos. Y no por tener un lenguaje sin alusiones al racismo, o a otro tipo de particularidades, deja de existir la discriminación. Más bien al contrario, pues ese lenguaje pretende ocultarla.

Saludos.

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We shouldn't take things out of context.

In Spain, the tremendous hypocrisy of "political correctness" has yet to sink, and so, a black man is called black (a galician, galician*).

In a festive environment, people can mess with some players physical conditions or their race. It'll suffice to have it discussed in a fields for it to be repeated in other spheres.

This is not to say that in Spain there is no racism, but certainly I believe not to the level of the anglosaxon nations.

Language or peoples mannerisms and expressions are one thing, another entirely the facts. The lack of racist remarks or allusions in a language does not mean there is no discrimination. On the contrary, as that language pretends to conceal it.

Greetings,





*an allusion to the treatment Galicians are subjected to, something akin to Polish people (Polacs) in the US

I can't believe you're saying this is not a big deal. Calling someone "black" vs. calling them "African American" is political correctness. Making monkey chants at someone is inexcusable and incredibly racist. There is no situation in which this type of behavior is acceptable. There is no getting around this.

As far as the levels of racism in "anglosaxon" nations vs. Spain, all I can say is that it would be absolutely unthinkable for an NFL player to have fans making monkey chants at him. It simply does not happen.
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No puedo creer que está diciendo que este no es serio. Llamando a algien "negro" contra le llamando "Americano Africano" es <<political correctness>>. Haciendo ruidos de monos sobre a algien es imperdonable y muy racista. No hay un situación cuando este tipo de comportamiento es aceptable. Es la verdad absoluta.

Hablando de las niveles de racismo entre paises "anglosaxon" y España, todo que puedo decir es que nunca sería un jugador de NFL tener aficionados haciendo ruidos de mono a él. Es decir nunca ocurre.

I'm sorry. I've been unable to respond earlier.

Berodia, your past messages have shown you to be a careful thinker, so this one surprised me.

The idea that Anglosaxons have more trouble with racism is laughable. The Roma (gypsies) would probably view this issue very differently, as would the native peoples of the Americas.

Until recent years Spanish culture has had low levels of immigration, so Spaniards have had less daily contact with non-Spaniards. That could make it seem like there is less racism in Spain, but it would be ridiculous to claim exemption from the human propensity to treat other peoples differently.

Racism and other kinds of conflict between peoples will naturally increase as the non-Spanish percentage of the population increases beyond a critical point. It appears that Spain may be reaching that tipping point. The recent protests by immigrants in the south of Spain show that these people are aware of an injustice. I've also heard complaints from Asturians about the increasing number of Africans and Muslims in Spain.

The recent tilt toward the Right and xenophobia in Italy also shows that modern Latin cultures are quite capable of racism. Gianni Alemanno, a neofascist, was elected mayor of Rome. His supporters shout "Duce, Duce!" (a reference to the fascist dictator, Mussolini). He and reelected prime minister Silvio Berlusconi have promised to crack down on immigrants and Roma. These election results show popular support for zenophobia. There has also been a marked increase in the number of racist attacks on Roma in recent months. Unfortunately, racism is alive and well among Latin peoples.

We're all in this together. Welcome to the human race.

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Lo siento. He sido incapaz de responder antes.

Berodia, los mensajes que has escrito antes han demostrado que estás un pensador cuidadoso, por lo que éste me sorprendió.

La idea de que los anglosaxons tengan más problemas con el racismo es risible. Los romaníes (gitanos), ciertamente verían esta cuestión muy diferentemente, al igual que los pueblos nativos de las Américas.

Hasta los últimos años la cultura española ha tenido bajos niveles de inmigración, por lo que los españoles han tenido menos contacto diario con los no-españoles. Esto podría hacer parecer que hay menos racismo en España, pero sería ridículo reclamar la exención de la propensión humana al tratar distintamente a otros pueblos.

El racismo y otros tipos de conflictos entre los pueblos naturalmente aumentará en España cuando el porcentaje de la población no-español aumenta más allá de un punto crítico. Parece posible que España esté llegando a ese punto de inflexión. Las recientes protestas de los inmigrantes en el sur de España muestran que estas personas son conscientes de una injusticia. También he escuchado unas quejas de asturianos sobre el número creciente de africanos y musulmanes en España.

La reciente inclinación hacia la derecha y la xenofobia en Italia también muestra que las culturas latinas modernas son bien capaces de racismo. Gianni Alemanno, un neo-fascista, fue elegido alcalde de Roma. Sus seguidores gritan "Duce, Duce!" (una referencia al dictador fascista, Mussolini). Él y el nuevamente reelegido primer ministro Silvio Berlusconi han prometido reprimir a los inmigrantes y los romaníes. Estos resultados electorales muestran un apoyo popular para la zenophobia. También ha sido un marcado aumento en el número de ataques racistas contra lo romaníes en los últimos meses. Por desgracia, el racismo está vivo y sano entre los pueblos latinos.

Todos caminamos juntos en esto. Bienvenido a la raza humana.